Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome back to another episode of the Capes and Tights podcast right here on capesandites.com. We welcome Jacoby Soseto to the podcast to talk it's only teenage wasteland and Frontera. I say the white american boy version of that. Jacobi says it way better on the podcast when he says it because he knows how to say it and I am just stupid. And yeah, a bunch of other stuff on here, too. So Jacobi's been a longtime listener and follower of the podcast. He's also an unbelievable artist who did some great work on it's only teenage wasteland as well as Frontera. So check those books out. You can get those right now at your local comic book shop or bookstores everywhere. Before you start listening to this episode. Check us out on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Blue sky, rate, review, subscribe, all those things over on Apple, Spotify and all your major podcasting platforms, as well as follow us on our YouTube channel for the video portion of this podcast. Thanks, everybody, for listening. This is Jacoby talking about it's only teenage wasteland frontera in the comic book industry as an artist. Enjoy, everyone.
Welcome to the podcast. Jacoby, how are you?
[00:01:20] Speaker B: I'm doing good.
I'm recovering from a sickness I got there you go for the holidays, so I sound rough.
[00:01:30] Speaker A: That's just how I maneuvered it somehow. I don't know.
I have a two and a half year old in the beginning of December ish. He woke up in the morning fine, then later on at night, he was, like, hacking up along, and then he had the cough for like four and a half weeks.
And I went to Christmas Day with my mother in law and my wife's stepdad, and everybody was sick there. And for somehow I did not get sick. And you know what's going to happen? It's like, now that I said this on this podcast, the next day I'm going to be like, coughing up.
[00:02:06] Speaker B: You're screwed.
[00:02:07] Speaker A: Yes, exactly. No, it's been a crazy time. Everybody's been sick. I think it's a little bit of the pandemic kind of made us stay home for a while, and everybody's immune systems probably aren't up to what they should be at, and someone has a droplet of sneeze on you and you're going to get sick.
[00:02:25] Speaker B: Yeah, it happened to me.
[00:02:29] Speaker A: That's not fun, but you sound great. Don't worry about it. Thank you. So, yeah, we're here to talk comics and know, Jacobi, you're a regular follower of us, and I've been meaning to ever since I read it's only teenage wasteland, and I love the artwork, and I've been meaning to reach out. We have had Kurt on the podcast to talk a little bit. It's only teenage wasteland, but we talked a lot about Indigo children, and you've been canceled that Kurt had going on at the time, and I want to get Micah Myers on at some point. Micah's on my list shortlist of getting on. I've had a couple of letterers on, but Micah's on that list as well. But we got you here to talk a little bit about comics, so that's a bonus right there to be mean. How long you been doing artwork? How'd you get into comics? Just a little bit of a short story on how you got into the world of comics.
[00:03:25] Speaker B: Yeah. Technically started because of my mom.
There's, like, this evening program going on here in Washington, and they're, like, promoting Emerald City back in 2012, 2011, I think. I don't remember specifically which year. And they were selling tickets at a comic shop, and I was into Star wars at the time, but never comics. And he was just like, well, whatever. Star wars is nerdy stuff. Hey, do you want to go to this? And I was like, sure, why not?
So we go to the comic shop. They sold out the tickets, but I was there already, and it was really cool.
I've never been in a comic shop, and this one specifically was, like a pretty big one.
And, yeah, that was like my freshman year of high school, and I just really fell in love. I always loved drawing beforehand, and I think kind of getting into comics, I started, it was like, hey, I draw. Hey, comic making is a job.
[00:04:43] Speaker A: Make those work together.
[00:04:48] Speaker B: And also because of my mom, she wanted me to go to school regardless.
So I was like, okay, what school can I go to? And there's not many colleges that do, like, comic went to. I was able to go to the school of Visual Arts in kind of. I did two years there, and I met my professor, Klaus Jansen, who was super cool, really took me under his wing, and that was like, I don't know, that was a really cool experience for me.
He didn't introduce me anyone or anything like that.
I was trying to make that happen, but no, but I think that schooling was really cool, and I learned a lot. Just kind of like the fundamentals, which I think have been extremely helpful. But I said, this is a lot of money. So I dropped out, but I got what I needed for sure.
And I think I want to say this was now, like, 2016. 2017 is kind of when I started going to conventions and being like, hey, look at my comics. And I do remember one thing.
I showed Marvel's talent scout Ricky Purden my, one of my pages. And I used to do a lot of splatter technique. Kind of like, at the time, I was really into Sean Murphy, so I was trying to embrace a little bit that inky splatter style. And I remember he looked at the pages, he was like, oh, splatter. I was, ah, okay.
But I think just going to conventions and showing my stuff around kind of, it helped me personally.
And meeting Robert Wilson the fourth, he was a big help and such a really cool guy. Like, I'm lucky to call him a friend now after all these years.
And then in 2019, actually, five years ago today, I met my current collaborator or frequent collaborator, who now is like my brother, basically, Julio Anta.
He reached out and, yeah, we just been making comics since. And that's kind of like how it all started. Yeah. And then we got books out now.
[00:07:33] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly.
The most recent book you two have out is Frontera. That came out in 2023, I believe. Yes, I'm pretty sure the summer of 23.
And then obviously, like I mentioned, it's only teenage wasteland came out in single issue format starting in December of 22. But then this came out this summer as well in the trade format from Dark Horse, which I love. Dark horse. I have a lot of guests on here from Dark Horse. And actually, my recording earlier that was going to be out this week, the week recording it. This one comes out next week, has a book coming out or at Dark Horse. Christopher golden. But yeah. So how did you get partnered up with Kurt for this? Did you know Kurt Pierre before this, or was this a dark horse thing? How did you end up on teenage weeks?
[00:08:22] Speaker B: So that was actually funny.
Know, usually how these things go is like, oh, the writer reaches out to the artist sometimes, especially for at least creator owned stuff.
So like I said before, I'm from Washington, and Kurt released a book with Alex Diato called Olympia.
And the book takes place in the town, Olympia in Washington.
And I really liked his book. And then I think he also released youth, and it features one of the characters name is Frank, and that's in relation to Frank Ocean, the musician. And Frank is my number one.
He's my favorite artist.
And I was like, well, he's already mentioned Olympia. He's already featured.
I. I'll shoot my shot. I actually reached out to him. I was like, hey, you write these things. I like both of these things. I feel like we could work really well together, or we just share a lot of interests, and I think we could work really well together on a book. He was like, yeah, sure.
I didn't even really think that he was going to reach back out.
Sorry.
We actually kind of went back and forth on ideas for projects, and he emails me, he's like, all right, I think I found the one for you. And it's only teenage wasteland. And I was so down for it.
You can kind of tell that the main character, it's. It's.
[00:10:12] Speaker A: It's like someone cloned, like, you and Peter Parker together, in my opinion. I was, like, looking through it again, glancing through it again, and I'm just like, oh, yeah, it looks a lot like you, but it also looks a lot like a version of Peter Parker in there as well.
A mexican american Peter Parker hobby in there. But just like you too, you drew yourself into the comic book.
[00:10:42] Speaker B: I will say that he did write the character description. It just happened to be the character description. It just happened to be me.
[00:10:51] Speaker A: Okay, that's cool. I'll take it. I can draw my.
[00:10:55] Speaker B: Easy for me to draw, I guess.
[00:10:57] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. He's like, oh, I'll make him a better looking version of me, though.
[00:11:00] Speaker B: Exactly. There you go.
[00:11:03] Speaker A: But, yeah, there's something that, first of all, you did the COVID for this too, right? It's only teenage baseline as well. Two things I wanted to point out. One, it's excellent. Second thing is, I'm so glad that this was chosen for the trade cover, too, because more recently, traditionally, I've seen publishers and creators use cover a of issue one as the thing. Because for the most part, when us and the media are promoting the book, it's always going to be cover a of issue one. That's the face of the book for the entire run. It could be a 300 series long book. And issue one is still, like, when people talk about spawn, it's like, spawn number one is the comic book show. But I think more recently than not, I think other people have picked other issues or a special cover for it or whatever. I remember it's one of those series out there. I don't remember exactly what it is, but it's that dark horse that they pick, like, issue three. And to me personally, I'm an art digital artist, a graphic artist. And to me personally, I was like, this is the worst cover out of all.
Literally, out of all the five issue series. I'm like, you picked the worst cover, and issue one had an awesome cover, and I think that's what's cool about to be. I loved this cover so much. It kind of shows a glimpse into the book really well, without giving too much away. And I'm so glad they picked this for the COVID of. Was this something that you had input on it? Was this all dark horse?
[00:12:28] Speaker B: I mean, yeah, they asked for me. They asked me. And also, I just kind of also had what you said. Usually, I think having the COVID like, issue one, cover a, is kind of my intention as well. You want to tell the story without having to say the words like, hey, here's what's happening.
I think the only issue I maybe would have if they didn't, for some reason, didn't want to do that one was maybe the last issue cover. But even then, that needs more context.
[00:13:01] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly.
That's the thing. It makes most sense to do that. I'm also a big fan of, and maybe this is just because of my design eye, is. I'm also very happy when the interior artist is also the COVID artist. Two things is, if you could draw the COVID you might as well draw the COVID because you're an artist, and you might as well do it. The second thing is, it does give you a glimpse inside the book, whereas there's some covers. I say this as a big Scotty young fan, too, but that's different. I feel like Scotty Young doesn't do cover A's for series that he's not internally drawing.
But, like, having you do the COVID makes. It gives you an idea of, when I pick this book up off the shelf at the comic book store, I can get an idea of what the interior looks like. Sometimes they're just drastically. I'm like, okay, you know, if, like, Martin Simon did a cover for you or something like that, or, like, if Scotty did the main cover for you, it would make much sense. That would be the saying, you know, there's certain people. You did go, yeah, I'll take it. But, no, I think it's. It makes sense because this art style you have in this book, that's amazing. I noted it when I did a review of issue one about how I liked it, how it fit Kurt's writing of the book and the post apocalyptic part about it. Was it weird coming out with an issue, comic book drawing a comic book of a post apocalyptic world in a world that we were basically in, a post apocalyptic world? Was that interesting? Did you grab the outside of what the world we lived in to bring into your art style.
[00:14:39] Speaker B: Just dying over here.
Yeah, it was funny kind of just drawing that, being like. I mean, it's not too many differences, I guess.
[00:14:49] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:14:52] Speaker B: But I like my post apocalyptic.
[00:14:58] Speaker A: It's great.
What did I use with the different styles of artwork nowadays in the world? Like I said, it kind of reminds me, your illustrations kind of remind me a lot of, like, I mentioned the Peter Parker thing, but some of the animated Peter Parker cartoons probably made cartoons, which I really liked. It's different. I think there's a lot of people who do a post apocalyptic style stuff, walking dead, things like that, that are more, like, grungy, more messy. You have more cleanliness to your lines. And I do like that a lot about these things.
Do you draw inspiration currently from anything else, or is it basically you've just found your style and this is what you're going with?
[00:15:43] Speaker B: Oh, no. I definitely pull from other artists. For the COVID specifically, I looked at Adrian Tomine and Kikulo. I'm, like, butchering his last name, Johnson. They're both, like, kind know New Yorker style cover artists and specifically for the covers because I wanted them to kind of be super graphic, eye catching a little bit.
But for the interiors, I remember giving the colorist Mark Dale.
My notes were like, hey, I know this isn't the best way to say, but could you color similarly to how Tanchi Zonjik colors his work? Because Tanchi Zanjik or Zonjik is a huge inspiration for me.
There's just something about his work that just every time he posts anything new, I'm looking at it forever. And just like, man, that was so cool. How the hell did he do that? Oh, that was a perfect, like, I don't.
I. I really enjoy coloring my own work a lot.
Obviously, because of the schedule.
Mark came through and he killed it.
But if I had the time, the money to color my own stuff, I probably always would.
[00:17:27] Speaker A: You color frontera?
[00:17:29] Speaker B: Yes, I did. Yes. Okay. That one was all me. I did the balloons, but not the letters.
[00:17:35] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:17:35] Speaker B: That was a weird process, but other than that, that was cool. Yeah, maybe a bit of a control freak.
[00:17:44] Speaker A: I can understand that. Like I said, it's one thing that's weird, even me being in the fringe of the comic book world. I haven't illustrated a comic book before, but I've illustrated digitally for can art because my day job is working at a brewery, and I have illustrated cans to the point where.
But I couldn't imagine doing lines on that.
Thinking back on it, I couldn't imagine just drawing the lines and the canning it over to a colorist and being like, okay, now you're responsible for that. Because I feel like it wouldn't be complete. I feel like I'd be missing something. I feel like I went back and changed things on it on the illustration, because I did it on procreate. So erasing things and changing things when colors wouldn't work, I feel like lines are permanent. Not permanent, but permanent to an extent that the colorists just have to work off that. And that, to me, would have been like, I don't know if I could ever do. I would be a control freak on that, too. I don't know if I could ever just do that, hand that off to someone, scheduling wise, yes, I would be.
[00:18:45] Speaker B: Able to do it.
[00:18:48] Speaker A: I don't have all the time in the world to do all that stuff, so I can imagine someone else helping me with my job in that sense.
But that's another reason why colorists do what they do, too. Colorist is good at it because they know how to take your artwork and cohesively make it better, if that makes any sense.
[00:19:03] Speaker B: No. Yeah.
I've only worked with a colorist now three times, and, yeah, it's just a lot of trust, and I'm working with one just recently, and the colors look killer, and I'm like, all right, I'm going to try to keep you around forever now.
[00:19:30] Speaker A: I feel like that's the way a lot of these teammates work. I mean, you mentioned Julio in working on frontier. Like, let's just do comics.
Mean, obviously, working with Kurt was probably an awesome experience as well.
[00:19:43] Speaker B: No, it was super.
[00:19:44] Speaker A: But, like, you think about, like, even Julio are just like, let's just do comics together. It makes it so much easier. I know you're writing, you know, my art. Let's just figure it.
[00:19:54] Speaker B: Talking. Julio and I, we were talking about our next book, and it would be like a sequel to the one that we're currently working on.
And I just remember texting him at the grocery store, here's my idea. And then he already sent the text, and it was the same idea, and I was like, perfect.
[00:20:14] Speaker A: Our minds are linked somehow in the greater world of, you know, obviously, you and Julio work well together. How was mean? Obviously, don't tell me any dirty secrets that don't make any sense that you want know, air dirty laundry. But no. Kurt was it like, working with Kurt was a fun experience?
[00:20:33] Speaker B: It was a super fun experience.
I think Kurt wasn't used to someone as collaborative, or at least he was like, all right, this is the script. Just have fun with it. And I think he really liked that we really were able to mesh together. And I think in the first issue, there's, like, a scene where Javi's talking to the reader.
Initially, it was kind of just, like, going to be just all, I think, captions, and there wasn't going to be, like, any scene to it. And I was like, hey, is it cool if we do it like this? And he was like, yeah, that's like, let's do it. Like, thanks. I'm so good.
[00:21:28] Speaker A: Listen, I don't know if you've watched sport basketball, but this is Michael Jordan's flu game, is a game where he plays with the flu. This is your Michael Jordan flu game, right?
[00:21:44] Speaker B: No, I think after that first issue, because that was, like, our first time really working together technically. But after that first issue, I think he's just like, hey, here's the script, basically. Here's the dialogue. Here's some point a, point b, kind of almost doing marvel style.
Have fun with it. And, yeah, just kind of let me go to town. A lot of not narrative, but how we got there is where we did a lot of the stuff and gags or whatever.
And, yeah, I think that was just super cool to do that. It's more so the scheduling thing, that's why we haven't done anything together again.
I know there's a comixology thing that hasn't been announced that I was able to do an issue for him. I don't know when that's coming out, but that was also fun.
[00:22:44] Speaker A: It was a good enough experience. You would work with Kurt.
We'd be able to read between the lines here. If you said no.
[00:22:52] Speaker B: Yeah, no, that was not fun.
[00:22:55] Speaker A: Yeah, it doesn't look like these two will be working together.
[00:22:57] Speaker B: Horrible time. Hated it.
[00:23:00] Speaker A: The funny thing is, and I obviously won't name names, but I've actually reached out to people before who have worked together on something, and I said, hey, I think I'm going to try to book these two people. Neither one of these guests, just so everybody knows, has actually come on the podcast yet, and they haven't actually scheduled yet. So you're not going to be able to try to figure out who these people are. But I've been in discussions with people, some people I'd have discussions with. I could have emailed you, and we could have talked back and forth, and at some point in the future, you'll get on the podcast. So that's what these people are. And two of them have worked together, and one of them said they didn't want to be on the same episode, and it wasn't because of the other person, but it just seemed like the way that they responded to the email that they didn't want to be on the episode with that person, and I had to been like, is everything okay? No, everything's okay. Just the timing is not going to work out. The way that they messaged me back was like, that they didn't want to be on with that person. And I'm like, did they not like working with that person? No, it was definitely a miscommunication. In a talking via email or text message doesn't always get the point across correctly, and that's what it was. But it was kind of funny. If you went like, yeah, I'd work again with Kurt, I'd be like, oh, interesting.
No, Kurt was fun. Kurt, like I said, he makes some great comics, and the fact that you were able to work together with Kurt is an awesome thing. But your main book that came out recently, and I will tell you right now that I wanted to read it before I came on here. And then I neglected to actually get my local book shop because they were out of issues of it to get it, and I haven't got one in yet, so I haven't been able to read it, and that's my fault, and I apologize, because I really want to read it.
But it's a graphic novel that you put out, what, 240 pages or so?
Was this designed originally to be a graphic novel? Like, from the beginning, you guys wanted to do it as a graphic novel?
No.
[00:25:03] Speaker B: Okay. So the idea initially started, so we did, like, julio and I, we did our first just short story together, just some portfolio stuff, basically. And he was like, hey, this unnamed comic publisher is hosting an anthology. Do you want to try to apply for it? Sure. We got denied from the anthology, and folio was like, I still want to do this story. And I was like, okay, so I think we did, like, ten pages that were kind of, like, going to become pitch pages, but we were kind of like, all right, how about we do a web comic kind of, like, similarly, like, heartstopper or on a sunbeam, and just release that, whatever schedule we would have done. But luckily, we didn't do that, because I was just kind of like, oh, God, we got to do that.
Julio kind of did this thing that was on Twitter called Pitmad, and you basically just pitch out, or you tweet out your assort pitch and put a hashtag pit mad and literary agents will be like, hey, can I represent you? And that's how we found our agent, Jess, and she helped us sell the book to Harper Collins. And that just led to this, know, I'm always grateful for that guy because he kind of just was like, he did his thing, and I happened just to tag along.
[00:26:52] Speaker A: So Frontera is a graphic novel you mentioned over at Harper Collins, but it's mexican american. Sheen crossing back to America after his family was deported. Is that true? Yeah. And then help from locals and a friendly ghost.
So it's a harrowing know. Obviously, between guys, everybody rates what they. This a. Is this a personal story to you and Julio, or is this just a great story that needs to be told?
[00:27:28] Speaker B: Well, that for sure. Always, I think, with know what he wants to write about, know a message for sure. And what we've been telling about the book is that everything in it, minus the ghost, is based on a true. Like, there's a jaguar in there called El Jefe. That's an actual jaguar that was separated from Mexico because of the border. And Julio is cuban, colombian.
His parents immigrated into the country.
My dad, he was from Mexico, so he had to come through the country. And none of our parents kind of went through this specific experience. But the message was also just super important to us, the story, and making sure that we tell these type of stories, too. And the main goal is to show empathy.
So someone who has no connection to this can read it and still be like, can understand there is no easy way to immigrate into the country.
It's just the truth.
And I think with knowing the fact that everything in the book is based on, based on true things, it kind of makes you, if you read the book, you're like, oh, Jesus.
[00:29:10] Speaker A: Yeah. And I could understand that. I really wish it was one of those things. I make my goal, obviously, to read not everything, obviously, because it's almost impossible. Some people, I had some people on recently, Brian Michael Bendis. I wasn't going to sit there and write every Brian Michael Bendis comic book ever created. That's a little difficult. But for the most part, I tried to get in. Like, I got so excited to read it's only teenage wasteland again, because I love that comic book. So I was like, oh, I'll read this. This is great. And then I was like, oh, and I'll go read Frontera. And then I realized I didn't have it. And that was a big issue for me because I'm like, it's not, I guess, I could have probably reached out to HarperCollins. Harper Collins could have sold me a digital. It would have been a whole thing. Because I do get advanced copies of things most of the time.
So I was able to read the description of it. Obviously, he's got a 4.1 on Goodreads.
You got, like, out of 409 ratings, which is for a graphic. So Goodreads is mostly novels, right? Like regular, straight ahead prose novels. This is a graphic novel. So some people tend to rate and review on Goodreads for graphic novels, and some people don't use that. They're not the same reader. You know what I mean? It's not the same person usually. And to have 409 ratings, 101 review is to have a four out of five stars. That's usually.
[00:30:32] Speaker B: I'll take it.
[00:30:33] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a very good review sense of there.
And you can get on Kindle for 99. I just saw that. I could have just bought it there. But no, the story seems great, and people's reviews of it seem awesome. It either connects with people or just knows it's an incredibly true, awesome story to be told and so on and so forth. So do you something like this, where it's like a project between you and Julio, where it's like, obviously you and Kurt did so in teenage waste then. But this seems a little bit more like you mentioned. We mentioned personal. Do you get more enjoyment out of illustrating something like this because of the fact that it is your baby? In a sense, I guess, yes.
[00:31:18] Speaker B: I actually was working on it's only teenage wasteland when I was finishing up this book.
[00:31:23] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:31:24] Speaker B: And it's hard for me to say because I'm doing frontetta for so long, it took me over a year to do everything.
So it's not that I don't enjoy, it's just like, you just are only focusing on this thing for so long. So to be able to then, hey, do you want to draw it's only teenage wasteland, and you read it's only teenage wasteland, you can probably guess that it's just a different vibe.
[00:31:59] Speaker A: Yes, it is.
Without even reading the other one, I can understand it's a different vibe.
[00:32:07] Speaker B: Yeah. There's not as many jokes in front of. I mean, it's still a hopeful story and good story, but it isn't that I don't necessarily get no enjoyment out. There's no specific one that I get more enjoyment out of.
It's just like, the stagnantness of it. So once I was able to get to draw it's, only teenage wasteland. I think I finished that first issue within a month because I was just so excited just to draw something else.
[00:32:40] Speaker A: I totally understand that completely. It makes sense that it's not just something different, it's something. It's not just one's better than the other. It was just something different. It could have been anything, honestly.
You could have had to draw a cover for something else or whatever. It just had to be something.
[00:32:55] Speaker B: No. And that's kind of something that's going on right now.
Julio and I are working on our next graphic novel, and I love the guy, but man, I'm just getting bored of drawing the same character over and over.
[00:33:09] Speaker A: That's why I don't think I could ever be.
I'm not good enough, I don't think, to be a sequential artist. But that's one of those tough things I think about sequential art is the fact that you have to draw the same character over and over and over again, and why. It might be one of the reasons why miniseries are big right now. I think a lot of us want something new and different, not even just illustrators, but colorists and letterers and writers. It's nice to touch different things and experience different. And we all have, let's be honest, how many different stories we probably have all in our heads. They want to get out. And so having miniseries and graphic novels are a fun way to get all of that stuff out in small chunks. And here's the honest thing is, graphic novels, I think, are going to take over floppy comics at some point. Maybe not tomorrow, but in the near future.
[00:34:01] Speaker B: I think so too. But I feel like the marketing for how graphic novels should be, I think they should be more marketed in the book market, like prose novels.
I've been kind of going through my little tiny marketing brain, and I've just been thinking, I feel like graphic novels should not to degrade them because I've worked on them. I know how much time, but they should be marketed as like, shotgun books, where it's just like, oh, you don't want to read a whole prose novel and use up a week of your time. Hey, how about you use like 2 hours? Check out this story. You get a complete story usually, and you still get the same emotional output. And I think because of the fact that we don't want to market the book as, hey, enjoy your 2 hours.
And I get that, and it's slightly disrespectful, probably to the creators, but I think if you use graphic novels like that, where it's just like, you will still create a new reader base, because they now are like, hey, I could just read this book and still get the same enjoyment out of reading the whole prose.
[00:35:23] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm a big novel reader. Prose novel reader. And I'm also, obviously a big comic book reader, and I feel like they both have unbelievable things to go with them. But one of the things I will say that I still tend to put comics over the prose novel is because of the fact that I feel like when I read a book over again, I don't get the same thing I get out of reading a comic book over again because of the artwork, and I think that's. Again, sometimes I feel like my brain might be steered one way or the other because of the art sense to it, but I do think that I read a comic book the first time through. They say issue one of something. I did this a lot, and I understood this a lot with the last Ronan, because of the gap between the last Ronan issues, because of how long it took them to make the book. They was, like, three month gaps, and so it almost forced yourself to reread the last issue so that you'd understand what was going on in the next issue. And so I read issue one, like, four times, because by the time I got to issue five, I needed to read it and then read number two and number three and so on.
[00:36:27] Speaker B: And so for that.
[00:36:31] Speaker A: First of all, I was a big fan of Ben Bishop in the first place, but it got me to love Ben's art more, because it was able to, like, okay, the first time went through was, want to understand the story, what's going on? And then the second time I read it through is like, okay, what's going on? But also, what's the intricacies that they put in the artwork? Why was this person here? Or so on and so forth. And by the fifth or 6th time you read it through, you're gaining all of this. More personally, I could be wrong. I want an author, an actual author, to tell me that I'm wrong. I don't think I'd read a book any different than I read it the first time. I might be looking for something, or with knowing the ending of the book, I might be looking for those clues that were written into the book earlier. But I don't think I'd read it that much different than sometimes I do. I've sometimes read books and then just gone through and not even read the bubbles and just gone through and looked at all the panels, and then I feel like there's more, better money investing in one of these, I think, than buying a 1990 $9 book, because there's so much more involved in this. On the other side of it, though, I've had parents who have complained to me before because I got them whatever. I got their kid a book, and they're like, they read it in 2 hours, and it's now on the floor in their row. I'm like, yeah, I know a novel is probably going to take them weeks to read. They're done with it in 2 seconds. But, hey, what are you going to do?
[00:37:45] Speaker B: I mean, it's kind of the age old problem of just comics in general is where it's like they're not taken serious.
If someone got it's only in teenage wasteland, I would be like, yeah, I can understand why that wasn't taken seriously.
That's the whole point of the book.
But, yeah, like, your rereadability. You're right about that, because there is just something there, like, okay, yeah, you got the story now. Okay, let's go back again. Oh, what was this little site gag?
And I think that's the fun about it, too.
Well, usually there's two people. Well, there's a whole team, but at front, there's usually the two people. You have the story part where you catch and then you see what the other person is bringing as well.
[00:38:39] Speaker A: I work on can art, and that's one of the things I talked about. I've talked about many times on the podcast, but it's a team effort. Am I the one physically putting the digital pencil, my apple pencil to the iPad? Or am I the one clicking the mouse around and doing the work on the computer? Yes, but that doesn't mean that I'm the one that solely was the one that came up with the idea or the colors or whatever. We have a team of people who go through and say, what if we did the can art yellow as the main color, and then I work the design around that and so on and so forth. It's the same thing with your artwork. Like, Kurt came to you and said, this is what hobby is going to look like, and you're like, that looks like me. And I could easily do that. But there's other things in the book. I'm sure there's background characters or other characters that you had a little bit of input on, and you don't see that the same, obviously, in a prose novel. Prose novel is the person writing the book a lot of times, and the editor, and so the teamwork behind it. The sense of letterers sometimes are like, well, can you not put the person there? Because I need to put a bubble there. And then you have this ability to work around together on things, or you messaging and saying, mark, can you please make the colors look similar to this? Because I like this or whatever. Or the colors in Fronter are definitely brighter, obviously, than the colors that are in something like, it's only teenage wasteland, where it's a post apocalyptic style book. So there's a lot of our team in there. Not that one's better than the other.
You and I are going to get villainized here from the people who love novels over graphic novels. But I do agree with you. The fact that a graphic novel is almost closer to a book than it is a comic book in that sense, like, the idea that it's a complete story, it's something that you can sit down and so on and so forth. A lot of graphic novels like this one are published by publishers that publishes.
So, like, in the same sense, also, in some sense, it's better marketing because I'm pretty sure that your book Fronter was marketed for longer.
I'm sure you could have preordered it for months and months and months in advance, whereas a lot of times, I don't know if you have a comic book coming out, a lot of times I don't know about it until like two or three weeks in advance.
[00:40:41] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:40:42] Speaker A: And it's in previews world without a cover because they haven't finished the COVID yet.
You know what I mean?
[00:40:47] Speaker B: Yeah, no, that was an interesting thing, too.
When I started out, I had no intention of doing graphic novels or stuff for the, well, one, I didn't even know about the book market for graphic novel, so I was used to what you're talking about, like, previews. Oh, go through diamond. Everything's like, short schedule.
We sold this book in 2020, literally march or April. We're two months into Covid of 2020, and the book just came out in July, in 2023.
I finished all the artwork in July, 2022.
So that whole year, it was just like, pain.
I was like, I want the book to be out now. Can we talk about it?
[00:41:46] Speaker A: That's so funny how you mentioned that, because it's the same thing. I'm always like, I don't know if I could wait that long for someone to see something that I created. A lot of times I used to do these podcast episodes, like, Monday for Wednesday, so that I'm like, okay, Monday, Monday night, I'll edit it. I'll edit it again Tuesday, maybe Wednesday morning at like 03:00 in the morning, goes live online. So I have to worry about. I'm like, I'm so excited for people to listen to this episode, and I have to worry about it. Then I started doing them like a week or two weeks in advance so that just in case something happened or it gave me more time to edit or whatever, and then I'm like, oh, but I really want someone to listen. And I'm having a second child in March, and so I'm trying to plan. Thank you. I'm trying to plan in February to do, like, four or five episodes someone in addition, so that I can plan them and schedule them ahead of time. So I have emails out. Actually, when you signed on, I was working back and forth with someone on having them come on. And I'm trying to do episodes that I'm recording on the 26 February for the 27 March because of that. Just trying to plan ahead so I can totally see where you're coming from on that. And the episode that released this is before this one, Christopher golden was talking about the idea that he just wants people to read his books. Like, the money side, obviously, you're making a living at this. That's what you're doing for a living. You're trying to get paid for this. But also, when you put all that work into something they're really proud of, in the end, if someone came up to you at a convention and was, like, told you a story that was very similar to what goes on in Frontera, like the idea of crossing the border and doing all that stuff, this might be a small possibility where you're like, just take this. I want you to read, like, let me send you a PDF. Let me sue something to have it. So you read it. Yes. You want to make money, but in the same sense, you're an artist and you want people to read your artwork.
[00:43:27] Speaker B: Or see your artwork.
[00:43:28] Speaker A: And so getting it in front of people is good. So waiting a year to get in.
[00:43:33] Speaker B: Front of people to be proud of it.
Yes. I agree with everything that you just said at New York Comic Con. It was really cool.
Know, that was our first convention with the book being out, and I actually got to the table together, too. So it's always lovely seeing him.
And people were coming up to us. We're like, hey, we read this. We really loved it. I have family members that really.
It's validating to have that experience.
I love praise.
I like when people say, hey, great job. I'll play humble, but it feels awesome. It fuels me.
[00:44:29] Speaker A: The funny thing is, it does get easier, if that makes any sense to people. It doesn't sound like you want to pat yourself on the back, but when you hear it more often, it does get easier to take. The first couple of times you hear it, you're like, stop, I don't want to hear it. And after a while, it's not that you come immune to it. We go, okay. You can start learning to accept positive.
[00:44:46] Speaker B: Yeah, you can appreciate it.
But, yes, the waiting part, oh, my God, it's killing me.
I've mentioned it before, but Julian, I. We have our next book. It's coming out this year in October, and I'm, like, dying to talk about it. I'm literally dying. I'm just like, it needs to be out.
[00:45:15] Speaker A: Do you have people you send things to? Like, do you have other people, creatives in the industry that you send things to, to read, to have a discussion about with? Like, do you have your opinions other than Julio? Obviously, Julio is one of those things. But would you send it to another artist and be like, this is the thing I just finished. Doesn't come out for a year. Do you think about it, or do.
[00:45:35] Speaker B: You actually, I do.
[00:45:37] Speaker A: I didn't know if that suffices. A little bit of your waiting game. Does it help a little bit that someone else is actually putting eyes to this thing that you work so hard?
[00:45:45] Speaker B: A little bit. I think it's, like, out of necessity. Now, check this out.
[00:45:50] Speaker A: Please make sure there's no errors.
[00:45:53] Speaker B: No.
So I finished the COVID for this unannounced project back in summertime and crap. You not. It was one of my favorite covers ever.
You know how you don't usually like your work, but this is one of the times where I was just like, I love it.
[00:46:15] Speaker A: Typically for me, it's the one I absolutely love that everybody else is like, what?
[00:46:18] Speaker B: Exactly, right?
[00:46:20] Speaker A: Typically for me, I'm like, because I can art. I'm always like, I'm so happy they're going to be so happy with this can. And I show it to them. They're like, well, we were actually thinking this, and I'm like, yeah, I love this so much.
I'm glad you love it, though. It does take a little bit to love your own work, mostly because of the colors, but that's you coloring your own stuff, and that's what happens. Did you color the COVID of soul and teenage wasteland, or was that mark as well?
[00:46:45] Speaker B: Yeah, no, I did.
I actually messaged mostly other writers.
I'm just beefing with all the artists. No, exactly.
[00:47:00] Speaker A: I don't like any other artists out there. I am the greatest there is.
[00:47:04] Speaker B: No, the writers, they like talking to me for some reason.
I think you want something from me.
[00:47:10] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Right. They want to put you in their back pockets just in case they haven't an artist. They're like, oh, I can just message.
[00:47:15] Speaker B: Them and see it's working.
I only talk to the people that pay me.
[00:47:20] Speaker A: What book? Are we going to make some money on this book.
[00:47:22] Speaker B: Cool.
[00:47:23] Speaker A: We'll be friends.
[00:47:24] Speaker B: All right. We can conversate.
[00:47:26] Speaker A: Exactly.
So that's cool. I would love to, actually, if it ended up working out to have you and Julio come on closer to when this book comes out at the end of the year and discuss this book, because I will read it before we get at that point. I'll make sure I get it. Probably get it through Netgalley or something like that, where you can get things on there. But no, I mean, I talk about a lot of writers on here because it tends to be the people who are. When I ask them, what's this book about? They tend to be the one that you. Yeah, they know what has the blurb in their head. And actually, most of them don't, which is weird. I'm like, how many times have you talked about this book and you don't know what this book is about? Like an easy way to explain this book.
And I'm like, then how is the local comic book shop owner going to be able to explain this book to someone if you can't explain this book to someone?
But it's nice. I noticed that. I went back and I was like, I don't talk to that many artists. And it's not because the artists aren't good or whatever. You guys are also super busy. So that's another thing. It's one of those things that a lot of times not think writers aren't. But if a writer is not working on a number of projects, they're like, okay, the script's in now. It's in the hand of you, the colorist and the letterer. But I don't know. Sometimes it just works out the way. Luckily, a lot of times people, when I've talked to artists or writers, they've brought the artist on with them. So that's been nice, too.
[00:48:47] Speaker B: But talking to an artist, a little freak.
[00:48:49] Speaker A: Yes, we'll do artists talking to you about art in general. That's what's cool about this episode. We obviously had something to base it on. But just talking about comic book art in general is always fun. And I'm guessing you're hoping to make a long career out of it and do a lot of different stuff.
[00:49:07] Speaker B: I mean, I just want to get rich and I can retire as soon as possible. Pull a mignola.
[00:49:13] Speaker A: Exactly. And then just come out of the shadows every once in a while to do something. A cover here and there or something.
[00:49:19] Speaker B: And then you need me draw a little weird thing.
[00:49:23] Speaker A: Sure, I'll do that.
It's a fun, weird, chaotic industry, but graphic novel. I'm excited for another graphic novel. That would be nice for you to come out with. I'm guessing you did that single thing like you mentioned for comixology, stuff that hasn't announced to do. You would like more comics in general, just like regular single issue comics too.
[00:49:49] Speaker B: Always talking with Julio. We have some ideas.
We like the payments of the book market. We won't lie about that. But we also like comics people. A lot of our friends are in the comics market.
[00:50:03] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:50:05] Speaker B: We have some ideas. It's just a matter. We've been like, all right, let's try to make a bunch of money in the book market so then we can actually fund the comic.
But also, I have something at Mad Cave with my good australian friend Christoph Bogax.
What else?
I think that's it.
[00:50:31] Speaker A: That hasn't been announced yet.
[00:50:34] Speaker B: A lot of these things are.
[00:50:36] Speaker A: I'm just trying to think of. I just saw, because I have access to the Mad cave media site.
[00:50:42] Speaker B: Yeah, no, it's nowhere.
[00:50:46] Speaker A: They have something that's out in March.
I just didn't know. No, your name's not on any of. Sorry.
[00:50:52] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm not even the database.
[00:50:55] Speaker A: No, it was just funny because actually, it's funny because I get emails that I stumbled upon a book that comes out in March. They haven't emailed me back a bit, so I won't say it now because I don't know if we're allowed to say anything yet, but there's a book that comes out in March, and I was like, wow, they're on top of that. I love Mad cave. So they're on top of stuff over there.
[00:51:11] Speaker B: I enjoy their books a lot.
I mean, they did even canceled book. And that was a fun, energetic book, that one.
[00:51:24] Speaker A: My second favorite comic book of the year, it turned out to be legacy of violence.
That book was unbelievable. Colin Bunn and Andrea Mutey. And then, well, my favorite comic book of the year was 8 billion genies, but that was kind of cheating because only like two issues came out this year, but still. It was my number one comic book last year, too, but, yeah, and then you've been canceled. Just came out in trade, and their trades come out to be pretty well, too. But dark horse kills it, too.
[00:51:53] Speaker B: I got to check out the trade for that one. And that was a fun book.
[00:51:58] Speaker A: I like the spot gloss on these, too. Like, the letters are spot gloss and the photos on the back are cool.
[00:52:05] Speaker B: The designer on that, I'm, like, forgetting their name. They killed it on the trade.
[00:52:11] Speaker A: It's a fun thing. They put it in here. I'm guessing Sarah Terry.
Does that sound correctly? It says designer Sarah Terry.
[00:52:17] Speaker B: Okay, well, that's who's credited it then. I'll say, yes. I love that trade. I love the use of the color lines and that they kind of implement it from the book because you actually saw that you have that single issues. They kind of did something on the back.
I'm nothing against it, but I like what they did with the trade. Yes.
[00:52:39] Speaker A: Well, that's one of those things. We could have another whole discussion, and actually, it could be one of those things we discuss when you come back on to talk about your next book is the breakup that some trades that were comics in the originally, the collected format, sometimes they just go from issue five or issue three to four and four to five. There's no gap, so you don't know where you are. Or it's very plain, and there's two options. I like about it the way they did here between gaps and having those lines and doing that is awesome. Or just put the COVID of the second issue on there so at least know it's a nice thing in there. What I didn't see is it doesn't look like you didn't get all your covers in the back of this thing.
[00:53:20] Speaker B: I think that there should have been every cover.
I think there is one, like, little freak.
I think it was just kind of paged weird. Yes.
[00:53:32] Speaker A: They're in. And then it does.
[00:53:34] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:53:34] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:53:35] Speaker B: Because also, I think I do remember flipping through. I was like, wait, where's the COVID to issue two? Or something like that?
They got the QR codes, too, for the playlist.
I love that.
[00:53:50] Speaker A: They're great. Everything's beautiful about it. I can't wait to get my hands on your graphic novel fronter so I can actually read it and do that in my extreme amount of time to read things. I'm going to squeeze it in.
[00:54:04] Speaker B: Yeah, well, that was one of those.
[00:54:06] Speaker A: Things that I just got an email from someone saying, yeah, could you do early February and I'm like, it's on my to read list. And I'm like, yeah, let's not do too early because I don't know if I'm going to be able to get it in between now and then to hopefully that I can actually get it in there. But I try to read as much as I can. So I'll get Frontiera in there, don't worry. But you can get it. Anybody else can get it anywhere books are sold, including your local comic book shop. And if they don't have a copy on the shelf, just tell them and they can get one for you. Usually it takes a week or two, but they can get it. So don't go into lcs and be like, oh, they don't have it. I'll just buy it on the big box stores.
[00:54:45] Speaker B: That's it.
[00:54:47] Speaker A: They can get it. And same thing with your local bookstore, just say, hey, can I get this graphic novel? And if they get books from Harper Collins, they're going to be able to get this book. It's not like they're not going to be able to get it. And if bookstore that doesn't sell Harper Collins would be a weird book.
Um, and then if you can't find anywhere else or you don't want to do anything and you just want the quickest and easiest way, just buy it on Amazon. People, I hate to say it doesn't matter at this point because the more people buy your graphic novel on Amazon, the more a you're going to make on it and you want to be rich. So there's that. And the second thing is it shows Harper Collins that they invested into you and did a good thing that way. So they'll continuously you more books and they'll continuously give you more money. So no matter where you buy it, still records a tally somewhere that someone bought your book. The one thing I will tell you not to do is steal it off the Internet. That's the only thing I will tell you not to do.
[00:55:36] Speaker B: Please don't just go to a library. At least if you want to read it for free, go to a library, support your local library, or borrow a.
[00:55:43] Speaker A: Friend'S copy or whatever you need.
[00:55:45] Speaker B: Or rob your friend. Yes, rob your friend.
[00:55:48] Speaker A: Borrow it.
[00:55:48] Speaker B: Regardless if they have the book, borrow.
[00:55:50] Speaker A: It and then never give it back. Yeah, just rob them. And if they don't have that, rob them. Just steal a different book they have.
[00:55:57] Speaker B: Just take a money that they had.
[00:55:59] Speaker A: That you robbed to do that. What did I just watch recently? Twelve monkeys have you ever seen that movie twelve Monkeys with Bruce Willis and Brad Pitt?
[00:56:09] Speaker B: I have not.
[00:56:10] Speaker A: Whatever. In the movie, they're running from. Running from someone and they kill some guy. And she's like, well, take his wallet. We're going to rob him now. She goes, well, we need money. And he's like, oh, okay. That makes.
She's like, no, I'm not just saying we should just rob the guy. I'm saying we don't have any cash or we need to get a cab money.
[00:56:30] Speaker B: So you need money killing it.
[00:56:32] Speaker A: Rob your frame, sell something, I don't know, kidney blood. You can sell your blood plasma.
[00:56:38] Speaker B: Very expensive now.
[00:56:39] Speaker A: Exactly. Start doing that. People are going to start capes and tights podcast. And Jacobi says to sell your blood to buy comics.
So. Yeah, both of them. It's only teenage wasteland and frontier. I'm guessing your other books are available in formats as well. I'm guessing you can find most of them out there.
[00:56:57] Speaker B: I don't know.
[00:56:58] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:56:58] Speaker B: I did a DC short. You could probably find that on like, kindle or some back issue box. It was in DC's legion of bloom. Okay, that's. Julio and I, we did a blue beetle story with animal, mineral, vegetable man as the villain.
There's also other short stories in there.
I was in the Glad award winning anthology young men in love.
A lot of good stories. I was the first story in that anthology with Tate. I'm not going to say his last name.
[00:57:34] Speaker A: Tate Bromble. Yeah.
[00:57:36] Speaker B: Yeah. Because, well, Julio makes fun of me. I said it a specific way. He said, how you say it.
[00:57:42] Speaker A: I don't know. I just read these things. Yeah, we read people's names in digital or on paper format. We don't know how to say these people's names.
[00:57:50] Speaker B: But yeah, I got my comp for that one. And know, literally just open it and there's me.
[00:57:55] Speaker A: And I was like, look at that.
[00:57:58] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly.
[00:57:59] Speaker A: Can you buy angel boy anywhere?
[00:58:00] Speaker B: Or is that angel boy?
That's my own personal zine.
One day you will be able to buy that, hopefully in bookstores everywhere.
It will be out, I promise you, within ten years.
Yeah.
Do you do New year's resolutions?
[00:58:31] Speaker A: Not really. I'm going to read more this year. But that's not like I didn't actually like.
[00:58:36] Speaker B: That's just part of the job.
[00:58:38] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly.
Well, I don't know. I just felt like even that I read more in the sense that I also listen to audiobooks. And so if I'm doing the dishes, my son was sleeping yesterday and I was doing the dishes and I was like, throw an earbud in, listen to some audiobook, or stop scrolling on Facebook and Instagram. Do a couple minutes of. I'm not going to stop scrolling altogether, but do a couple minutes of that. But then put your phone down and read a book or a comic. Because then I get to myself. I'm like, oh, I'm too tired. I want to go to bed. And then I just skip reading. And it's like, issue. That's my kind of resolution. I didn't actually make an official one. Like, hey, I'm not going to do this. I can make one. I'm like, I'm going to have a baby this year.
[00:59:18] Speaker B: That's true.
[00:59:18] Speaker A: Have a baby in 2024. Look at that. I'm going to. Oh, I'm not going to. My wife's going to do all the work on that.
[00:59:23] Speaker B: Can't even do that one right.
[00:59:25] Speaker A: But did you do one or.
[00:59:27] Speaker B: No, I usually always just say, complain more.
[00:59:31] Speaker A: Get what you want, right?
[00:59:33] Speaker B: I think I'm off to a good start.
[00:59:35] Speaker A: Good start there. Complain more.
But, yeah, so, yeah, you can get all your stuff that is in published work out there. Just type your name on the Internet. I'm sure you'll be able to find it. But I would highly recommend it's only teenage wasteland.
I would highly recommend Frontera, even though I've not read it yet. But I'm just going to say that.
[00:59:54] Speaker B: I would recommend it. Yes.
[00:59:55] Speaker A: Because even if you just want to look at the artwork, forget Julio. If you just want to look at the artwork, it's worth buying.
[01:00:01] Speaker B: That's me.
[01:00:02] Speaker A: I forget where I now I can't remember where I put. I don't have my list here. I don't know where it's. Only teenage wasteland showed up on my list of comics of the year. I don't know.
I want to pull that episode up.
[01:00:13] Speaker B: With the top five at least.
[01:00:17] Speaker A: God, I had to be right. I don't know. I deleted the notes on that literally before we started recording. I move it over to a hard drive, and I deleted it, and I have to unplug the hard drive to plug in the so. Oh, well. But it's only teenage wasteland is highly recommended for me. Check it out. You can get it.
And, yeah, keep up the great work. Keep following us and supporting us. I really appreciate me. Every time I see your name pop up on Instagram saying, you like the photo, I'm always like, see, look at that. That's what I do it for. I do it for Jacobi, and Jacobi only. There you go.
[01:00:51] Speaker B: That's me.
[01:00:51] Speaker A: My number one fan. One of four fans. No, I was kidding.
[01:00:56] Speaker B: But, yeah.
[01:00:56] Speaker A: So check it out. And you have a website, some artwork on there, covers on there, and stuff like that. Your shop is empty. One of these days, you'll start selling things again.
[01:01:04] Speaker B: Maybe. We'll see.
[01:01:06] Speaker A: Maybe just put one thing in there for, like, a million dollars, and like, well, I have something listed. You want to buy it and buy.
[01:01:12] Speaker B: It, who's going to pull the plug?
[01:01:14] Speaker A: Charles Soules tried to sell Ryan Brown on there for a million dollars on his surprise. I don't know if he got in trouble and turned it because he's human trafficking, but I don't know.
[01:01:24] Speaker B: I guess he can represent himself. He's a lawyer.
[01:01:27] Speaker A: Exactly. Right. Well, he said that because I interviewed him. He's like, we would talk to our lawyer. I'm like, you're not your own lawyer. And he's like, no, we have a lawyer that specializes in this thing, and I'm not practicing the law anymore. I'm like, okay, I don't know. Whatever. Thought it would be cheaper having your own. Yeah, exactly.
Jacobi, thank you so much for taking your time out to talk to us about comics.
[01:01:46] Speaker B: Thank you for having me.
[01:01:48] Speaker A: Random stuff. We'll have you back on, for sure. We'll get in touch again and get you and Julio on to talk about your next project when you have the information and if you have anything before that you want to send out to, let me know. Not, like, ahead of time, but I'm saying I'll help promote the book, is what my point is.
[01:02:06] Speaker B: Let me know.
[01:02:09] Speaker A: Any books you want, just send us to us. You have my email address. Send me an email, and we'll promote it because we're big fans of your work, so keep it up, and I'm glad that you are going to add your name to the list of smart people who dropped out of school to become excellent and amazing.
[01:02:26] Speaker B: Thank James Heron. You know what? I dropped out because of James Heron.
[01:02:35] Speaker A: We're going to end there. That's it.
[01:02:37] Speaker B: He went to SBA. I messaged him. I said, you went to the SBA? He said, yep, I dropped out after my second year. I said, I'll do that, too.
[01:02:46] Speaker A: You're going to just start making the program, like, two years.
We just got to make sure it's a year and a half, two years. We're going to cram it all on there. So when people drop out, at least they get all the schooling that they need. No, but again, I appreciate it so much. Thank you so much. Heal up some more and get to 100% here. And I'm sorry about the little blip. We literally had a power blip in the middle of this episode. But you know what? The magic of editing allows me to make it seamless. Right?
[01:03:10] Speaker B: You won't notice it.
[01:03:11] Speaker A: I want to put a little thing at the beginning. That's what I'll do. I'll use the lines, the tv lines from it here. I'll just put it there for, like, five minutes that it took us to get back on. No, I'm kidding. Thank you, Chacobi. I very appreciate it. Have a good day.
