Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome back to the Capes and Tights podcast right here on Capesandtights.com I'm your host, Justin Soderbergh. Once again, this episode is brought to you by our friends over at Galactic Comics and Collectibles at galactic comics and collectibles.com this episode we welcome Tyler Boss to the podcast. Tyler is the artist of such books such as what's the Furthest Place From Here? Four Kids Walk Into a Bank, Dead Dog, Spite, and many more variant covers and other comics. Boss recently released a debut issue of his new comic, you'll do bad Things, where he serves as the writer on the series.
This episode we chatted, you'll do bad Things. What's the furthest place I'm here Writing versus illustrating and so much more. So check this episode out with Tyler Bost. But before you do, follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, bluesky, threads, all those places you can rate, review, subscribe, and all that stuff over on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you find your podcasts. You can also find us on YouTube and as always, you can visit capesandtice.com for so much more. This is Tyler Boss chatting. You'll Do Bad Things right here on the Gates and Tights podcast. Enjoy, everyone.
Welcome to the podcast. Tyler, how are you today?
[00:01:10] Speaker B: I'm good, Justin. Thanks for having me.
[00:01:12] Speaker A: Absolutely. And thank you for working around our crazy schedules to make this work. I know you've been traveling and doing some touring with you all Do Bad Things. How's that been going?
[00:01:21] Speaker B: It was good. We just. Me and Matt just finished 30 day 312 days ago.
And so I made it home in the intended way. Matt, he was supposed to have a nice direct flight and instead he got to spend some time in Detroit. But he's home. He's home now too, and it was good.
[00:01:41] Speaker A: Risk of alienating Detroit listeners. Yeah, Detroit's not. Seems like a place I would like layover in right at this moment in time, maybe somewhere sunny or something like that, somewhere nice. But yeah, I guess it's the end of the winter, so it's not that bad. But yeah, yeah, for sure.
[00:01:54] Speaker B: And I think. I think if. If not for it being day 32 of what was supposed to be a 31, he probably would have loved the standards right at that point. I think he was ready to just.
[00:02:02] Speaker A: He's ready to get home, put his head down, work on comics, and not talk to anybody for a little while right now. So did you do mostly comic stores and things like that? Is that what you were doing?
[00:02:12] Speaker B: Yeah, so me and Matt both started out like working in shops and stuff. And so that's always been a big part of our sort of ethos as far as like, once we finish doing the fun part, which is making the work, the other part of the work is, you know, reaching out to shops and going there and you know, selfishly also too, like, we're comic shop nerds, so we like to see how everybody does. You know, we all kind of have the ability to sell the same material. But how do they. Every shop does it differently. And so yeah, it was awesome.
[00:02:42] Speaker A: That's so cool. This is also cool. I think it's like more of a recent thing too for creators to go like on some sort of a tour kind of thing. I know Tony Fleece did this whole like, you torn poster, all that stuff. I was like, what is going on here? I feel like he's touring with a band or something like that. But no, you see a lot of authors do like book tours and things like that. But like, it's really cool to see the creators nowadays getting into shops and doing that. And my buddy is a good, the godfather of my daughter is LCS owner. My LCS owner. And he loves just having anybody in there just sitting there signing autographs and saying hi to customers and things like that. Because he gets that. I don't know, it breaks that barrier between you guys being like above everybody else, if that makes any sense.
[00:03:21] Speaker B: Which is so goofy too for like, no. And like it truly is like it's a one hand watch and the other thing, like we can't do, we can't make books without a, you know, without a place to, you know, without the direct market. And then like it's the, in the direct market. And so it's like, no, it's super fun also. Just like, you know, you spend all day sitting in a room by yourself like making these things. You're like, I don't know if this is for anybody. And so you get to go out and like meet the different communities that like these shops have built around them. And like, you know, it's funny like just like one small anecdote like the we went to a shop all shout out Final Boss games in New Jersey. And you know, I met one of the employees at the shop just doing New York Comic Con over there. He's if you got to come to the shop, you got to come to the shop. And I was like, all right, we're going to make it work this time. We're going to come. Yeah. And Matt Was like, booking it all. And he's like, I, you know, we're going there at 4:00 on a, like, Tuesday or something. Like, no one's gonna be there. And the owner's like, I don't know. He's like, I don't think we're gonna be able to get through everybody in an hour. And Matt's like, I promise you we will be. And then it was like, no. We had, like, a line, you know, wrapping around the whole store when we showed up going out, like, ended up having to stay half hour after range. Just like a bunch of hardcore kids in Jersey were all like, oh, I heard you guys are into records. Like, so it was awesome.
[00:04:33] Speaker A: That's so cool. I mean, it is. I mean, you guys, like, you mentioned you worked in comic book shops before you actually got into the creative side of things. When did that happen? When did that transition happen for you? When was that? That. That the gap between, like, selling people comics and knowing that you could do this for a living?
[00:04:49] Speaker B: For sure. The. So, like, I was going to School of Visual Arts at the same time that I was working at Forbidden Planet, which was the shop I worked at with Matt. And we had a bunch of people in our, like, class quote unquote, where it was like, me and Matt and Matthew Klein, who's at Penguin Random House now, and John Petrie was at Valiant and is also at Penguin Random House. And Vidya Ayala, who great writer Danny Lore.
There's probably even people I'm forgetting. But, like, me and Matt started working at the same time. And weirdly enough, like, Matt's a born and raised New Yorker. And when I moved there, I just so happened to move into an apartment three blocks from his apartment. So it's like we would work the same shifts, ride the train home, and, like, we would just talk story nonstop. And so it was always the intent to be, Sorry, my dog's coming to say hello.
It was always the intent to be a creator.
And, you know, it was things where Danny Lohr told me about Michael Lark needing a background anchor, like, saw post on Tumblr. And so that, like, I did the, you know, application for that, and that was my first ever gig was, you know, my coworker friend of mine had been like, oh, try out this thing. And like, all right, now I'm inking back backgrounds for Michael Arc. And yeah, that's probably my first foyer. But the. My senior project at SVA was the first issue or a version of the first issue of mine and Matt's book together. Four kids walk into a bank.
And that was. My teacher was David Mazzucchelli. So the joke I always say is that, like, four kids walk into a bank was edited by David Mazzucchelli. And then I say that, and he says, please stop saying that to people.
[00:06:25] Speaker A: That's amazing, though.
[00:06:26] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:06:27] Speaker A: I mean, now it's getting a feature film adaptation, isn't it? So, like, there you go. It's going places.
[00:06:32] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, he'd probably even hate that even more than making a movie. Comics are so much better.
[00:06:37] Speaker A: Good point. Good point. Yeah. That's an exciting thing. And I talked to Matt a little bit about that, too, towards the end of our episode when Matt was on about that and how cool that is actually, to see that your work's gonna be hopefully on the big screen at some time. Obviously, it takes time. There's things that happen. There's possibility they could fizzle out at some point and be like, okay, yep, onto the next thing. I talked to a creator, Jay Boninzinga. He wrote the recent book, a movie Killer, Killer's Game. He wrote the book that that's based on. And he said that was option. Like, I don't want to say it for, like, 30 years. It was some sort of crazy thing that every time the option would end, he just, like, his, like, agent would just put a check on his desk, and he'd be like, what's this? He's like, oh, Killer's Game got optioned again. And he's like, it sucked that it never got onto the screen. But, like, every couple of years, you just get a check for someone else wanting to. Wanting to make it into a movie. And he's like, no one gets to see it, but I still get paid for it. So it's what.
[00:07:27] Speaker B: Yeah, it definitely eases the sting. That's the quote. Don Draper. That's what the money's for. But no, yeah, it's. You know, the. I feel it's like, ours got optioned in 2017. And then it's like the constant thing where my talking to my mom or dad or whatever, they'd be like, is it coming? And I'd be like, I don't know, man. Like, but ours is being edited right now.
And so it's. At least at that stage. The joke me and Matt keep saying, too, is just that, like, I mean, you see what happens with some movies where they're shot, finished, ready to go, and they get axed anyways. So it's like, until we're sitting In a theater. Credits are rolling.
Still won't fully, fully believe it.
[00:08:03] Speaker A: Well, I think I feel like it's the comic book industry, but you really don't know when it comes out until it's actually on the shelf sometimes. So it doesn't foc. When was that? I don't talk about, oh, our comic is out. That's awesome. No, it's true though. It really is. I mean I feel like I'm I a close acquaintance now with Adam Caesar, who's. Who's clown in the cornfield comes out here pretty soon as well. And so like his novel being made into a movie is like finally now he feels like, I know it's only been a little bit of time. He's only been like five years or so, but like he's like, it's finally now he's. But still, even in being at south south by Southwest and getting it premiered, he's like, until it's actually in theaters, I still don't believe that they're not going to still cancel it.
[00:08:38] Speaker B: Even though I'm getting like Instagram real ads.
[00:08:41] Speaker A: Like, I don't know, man. There's still a possibility in this world we live in that's some sort of tax write off or whatever. But yeah, but yeah, you broke, I mean you broke into the industry mostly illustrating and inking and things like that, but obviously with you'll do bad things, you're writing this story.
Was it just your tired of working with Matthew Rosenberg? Is that.
[00:08:58] Speaker B: Yeah, it's a combination of that and hubris.
No, you know, it's a lot of it. I could blame that as why I'm writing is the thing where writing to me always seemed weirdly mystifying. For a long time I was kind of like, what is a writer? Right? Like what is like when I'm sitting down to draw, it's this sort of thing where it's like I have a set set of tools that I know how to like, you know, you. That I know can get production out of me. Like, I understand the process of what it means to be a quote unquote artist. Whereas for a writer I'm like, is that journaling? Is that, you know, doing index cards? Is that just doing the vomit doc and then editing? Is that like what is the process of being that? And you know, when me and Matt started working on what. What's the furthest place from here, Our ongoing image series, we would sort of, you know, we knew what the beginning of the story was, we knew what the end was. And then we kind of wanted to leave the middle open to sort of like, how do we get here to here? Then we had signposts that we knew we wanted to hit. But every issue is us, me and him. He comes to my house, or I go to New York City and we sit down for a week, and we just literally would talk out, like, here's what happens in every single issue. And then Matt would go and write a script. And I certain point that's kind of like. That's writing what we're doing there is. Right. And it was like, oh, okay. So this is. It sort of demystified the process a little bit where it's like, understanding, you know, I now. Now I feel like I have a set of tools in the same way for drawing, to get production out of me for writing. Whereas for a long time, I think a lot of people like myself are sort of maybe, like, scared. It feels almost too, you know, the. Without restrictions, you can kind of go in any direction. So you have, you know, you're constricted by no restrictions. Yeah. Placing things on you. And that sort of gave me the itch and bug to write more.
[00:10:44] Speaker A: And it's not like, yes, because you've written before, like, Dead Dogs Bite, like that. That book was your. But you did both. And so, like, this. This is the thing where you had to, like, relinquish something. I hate to say the word relinquish, but, like, as an illustrator, you like to see your. You know, to put your illustrations out there, too. So, like, you obviously either knew or it's a lot of work, so doing both of them is not gonna be possible. Or you wanted someone else's vision on this too. What was the idea about not doing this all yourself? I mean, I'm guessing timing was an issue, for sure.
[00:11:12] Speaker B: I mean, it was a thing where I had the idea for the book and I really wanted to do it, and I really thought I would draw it myself, but I was drawn. I can't draw two books at a time. I'm just not. I'm so slow.
But the. The. I was drawn for this place, and I was like, oh, I'll get to this at some point. And then I was on my phone on Instagram or something, and it was like a portfolio share day. And Michael Walsh shared Adriano's work. Adriano Tortolici, who's the artist on Bad Things portfolio, on his Instagram story. And I was like, oh, lightning bolt moment. This is the book. This is what it's supposed to look like.
And it changed a lot of what the book would be. It was an interesting thing. Even in writing for Adriano, he was coming off kind of a negative experience. When I reached out to him where he had drawn two issues of a book for a publisher. And then some things happened at that publisher. And so the book got canned, but it was never going to come out. And so he was like, oh, I just, like, you know, it's rough to draw, like, 48 pages. Think it's your thing. And then, oh, these can never see the light of day.
So a lot of our early relationship was me trying to build trust with him. And so I kind of gave him what I thought was like a layup in the, like, first 10 pages of the script where I was like, you know, I'll give you a four wide, like, kind of how I would do it, where it's like, it's a really quiet moment after a loud moment, and it's all the same shot. You just have to do, like, of a car from above with, like, blood coming out of it, like an oil spill. And instead he draws it and it's. It's.
[00:12:35] Speaker A: He's.
[00:12:36] Speaker B: Boom, bang. We're inside the car, and it's loud. And so it's like, been a really cool learning experience with him where it's like seeing what my tendencies are as a writer or as. Even as an artist, and then watching Adriano sort of push and pull those things to his disposition or what he thinks works better. And, like, the constant conversation in it is really great.
And, yeah, it's been really illuminating in that sort of way where it's like, I've given him.
I'll give him really, like, for acting scenes, like, kind of no direction anymore. I kind of like, here's the dialogue. This is kind of what I'm thinking. But you go. Or if it's like a chase scene or like a really crazy action scene, I kind of like. I think I see it as this. But also, you, like, you know, it's almost more Marvel style. Like, you know, we need it to fit in this pages or whatever, and then we'll get in. I do a bunch of weirdo formalist stuff. So that gets really. Me being like, okay, so we're gonna do this, and it's really specific, and it's. We'll see. So it's.
[00:13:30] Speaker A: Yeah, it's funny. And I also laugh that you. You don't write that much. You're more of an illustrator. And then you. Your first, like, big comic like this, you know, obviously you Said your Dark Horse book. But, like, one that you stepped away. Just someone else illustrate is about a writer, which is like a regular, like a trope that I see so much with, like, prose novels nowadays, where it's like this writer in this horror novel is on, you know, excluded out in the woods somewhere writing a book. And I'm like, well, why is writers write about writers so much? And I was like, well, maybe it's because they write about what they know. And, you know, they write, like, they obviously know a lot about writing because they're writing. But you just did that writing, you know, writing this book. You have a guy who writes books, and you write about. You're going to write about a writer, even though you haven't had a huge history of writing. It's a. You know, it's a risk.
[00:14:12] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, for sure. It does end. It's a. It's a core tenant of what the story ends up, where it's. So it'll be.
Yeah, it was funny, the Hassan, the letter on the book, when I reached out to him about working on. He's like, oh, we could do some, like, really cool ancillary stuff in the back where you, like, write a bunch of prose, like, as the character in these things. And I was like, yeah, we ain't doing that, bro. Like, I can write a script, but I can't write prose. Like, that's. That is not my strong.
[00:14:36] Speaker A: No, that's not. That's not where you're going yet. Like I say, I'm a comic book writer. I'm not. You know, let's get into this. So you're not ready for your great American novel? You're not ready for that?
[00:14:45] Speaker B: Yeah, no. Yeah, we'll do that on the second one, right?
Yeah, I did one. Now we can. Now I'll just. I'll bang that out. It'll be, you know, writing's not that hard.
[00:14:57] Speaker A: Boy. It's funny, too. Cause I was talking to somebody. I'm reading the Stand from Stephen King. There's a new anthology coming out that's a bunch of stories from other authors that are writing about stories that happen within the Stand. And I had never read the Stand. I saw the TV show that came out with Whoopi Book Goldberg a couple of years ago and James Marsden. But I was like, I'll read the book. This is great. I'm like, 1200 pages, man. Like, how the hell do you write that much? Like, how much story do you need to have that? And I'm thinking, like, obviously a graphic Novel or something like that would be shorter because some of the descriptions that you're doing, you don't actually have to describe. You let the illustrator obviously take. Take that and do that. Like, you don't have to be like, they're wearing jeans and a T shirt. Like, obviously, you're drawing instead of writing it. But. But I'm still like, jesus, I don't know how, like, someone could sit there and write. I would get bored about six, halfway through being like, okay, I need another story. I need to write. I can't write this anymore.
[00:15:44] Speaker B: Like, I can't.
[00:15:45] Speaker A: I don' Just crazy.
[00:15:46] Speaker B: That was me listening to the IT audiobook and being like, holy shit, bro. I've listened to 22 hours of this, and we got somehow 40 more to go.
[00:15:55] Speaker A: It's like, how am I supposed to, like, quit my. Was Jerry Seinfeld or, sorry, George Costanza on Seinfeld? He's counting all of his coins, and she's like, yeah, I'll give you some. Some rolls to roll these coins up. And he's like, what do you want me to do? Quit my job? It's the same thing. Sometimes I feel like, oh, read the stand. What do you want me to do? Quit my job? No, it's. It's cool. I think I'm a big fan of your artwork, and so I'm always a fan of seeing what the other side of comic creation can do. And I think you nailed it.
To me, it's sometimes where I'm like, hey, stick to writing or stick to drawing. But, no, it was very well done, and I think that. Which is cool, because I feel like if I didn't know it was you, you know, I wouldn't have picked out being like, oh, I've seen most of this person's illustrations. But there is that finesse to it that a writer illustrator has when they write a book. It's a little different. And I think you. You can understand where things are going potentially as an illustrator, you know, like, maybe how things would be laid out maybe a little bit differently than someone who solely writes. And that's pretty cool. And I think you did that with this thing. But I'd say right now, I love your illustrations, but this book is phenomenally beautiful, Andrea. It's just. I'm glad that it wasn't you, if that makes any sense.
[00:17:00] Speaker B: No, no, for sure. No. No offense taken. I. 100%. It's funny with the book, too. Like, I always intended it to sort of be like a giallo pastiche. Like, we're doing that. We're doing 70s Italian horror. Yeah. But if it was going to be me, like, I probably couldn't have called it that. And then so, like, Adriano, what he's bringing into his inks being like, you know, very. From the Italian school of, like, how they approach cartooning, you know.
Oh, I just bought a bunch of his books at Flying Colors. Shout out. Why am I blanking on the artist's name? Oh, well, okay. A bunch of great Italian Sergio Topi or like, you know, Alberto. I guess he's Argentinian, but Alberto Brickia and these other ones where it's like lush inks, brushwork. We're going with textures, these things. But then the colors that Adriano brings where it's like we're doing these sort of two, three color scenes that are kind of evocative of sort of what Richmond Lewis was doing on Batman year one. Or, like, you know, even the Argento films that we're trying to kind of come from. And like, yeah, like, the book wouldn't be.
I feel like it's a right distillation of, like, yeah, Giallo as a comic book where it's like, without Adrano, it just would have been another horror comic book.
[00:18:13] Speaker A: Well, yeah, that adds that because I do believe one of my favorite things, I love reading and viewing and looking at immersing myself in a comic. But one of my biggest things, I love how it's a team and there is these. These excellent people who can do both things so perfectly well that it's just like, you know, and even then there's the people who are, like, even better talented who letter the thing themselves too. And it's like, how the hell do you do that first of all? But then, you know, share some talent with the rest of us. No, but this is something to do with two separate sets of eyes in minds and visions and a lot of stuff. Like, obviously you guys have to come together and say, this is what we want to do, but, like, having that second pair of eyes to be able to just say, this is what I visually see this look like, I think just adds so much more depth to a comic book. And I think that's so cool about these books is, like, that I don't would have expected that coming from this comic, like, on the front cover. I don't know if I would have been like, opening the pages up and I was just like, wow, like, this is amazing. Again, I love your illustration. So don't. Like, that's not even what was. What was done with this Book was phenomenally beautiful. And I think it's just again, it. To me it's different too. You know, it's just this different side of comics that I see right now in horror comics right now as it is. And I think that the colors, everything to do with it was just so gorgeous. It continues on for issues two and three that I have. It's just again, you want to look at it, you want to open the book and re. Look at the book again. Just don't forget the bird bubbles. Just look at the actual.
[00:19:35] Speaker B: Just ignore those.
[00:19:35] Speaker A: Yeah, just look at the art. No one cares about that. No, you're getting that now. You're getting the opposite side of that. People only want to look at the art in a comic book.
It's just gorgeous. It's a beautiful comic book. And I think that in this world we live in with horror, comic books are very, very, very, very prevalent that having something that stands out a little bit different in American comics is beautiful. And I think that this style does that.
[00:19:58] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean obviously I think Adriano. I think the world of Adrian. I mean. But our approach to is sort of too. Even when like the. This is maybe not something that people are going to necessarily notice, but even in the production of the book, we're thinking about things like that. Like we did the book in singles, sort of like self cover. So it feels kind of cheap. It feels kind of like very raggedy. And I feel like that like there was a time when I was like, oh, we should maybe do this on newsprint. But then we scrapped that idea because now, now newsprint sort of feels more almost like deluxe, even though it should feel like a throwback. So we're like, no, we'll do this. But then when we get to the collection, like there's a thing where, you know, we're pricing it and all these things now, but the full collection, like I'm. Do I want to do painted edges on the paper so that it'll be green or yellow? I haven't decided. Like whatever one's going to be. Not the most, but like truly try and make the trade feel like it's. It's. I don't want to say art object because that sounds like we're trying to heighten it. But it's more trying to be not just like your stock standard image tray, but it's thing where it's like, no, this is. And not too deluxe. It's like this weird middle ground where it's like it's still cheap because it's Comic books. Right. Like it's still inexpensive because it's the trade. But we've done enough where we're trying to bring in a production value of it that feels of a mind with what we're kind of doing.
[00:21:18] Speaker A: So yeah, that's cool. It's a cool thing that you do. The creator owned, you know, project like this too. It's like you have a little bit of freedom. Obviously Image has a bit of say too in promotion and marketing and all that stuff too. But like, there's this different side of things that you get to do with the creator own project. If you just got hired to do Daredevil, that's going to come out in a simple trade that's the same looking trade for everything. It's just the way it is. Which is fine until it's extremely, extremely, extremely popular. And then they're like, oh, now we're going to do something special with this book.
[00:21:46] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:21:47] Speaker A: No, but this gives you the ability to do that. It's really cool. It's a four issue series, right?
[00:21:51] Speaker B: Six.
[00:21:51] Speaker A: Six issue series. Why did I say only four? Maybe it's because maybe there's only solicited for four issues so far. I don't know.
[00:21:56] Speaker B: Yeah, I think the fifth solicit maybe came out literally today, you know, with distribution.
[00:22:02] Speaker A: You know how it is right now. It's pretty crazy how we figure that out. I literally was like, I got a solicit for a book was Uncanny Valley from Tony, Tony Fleece. And then I was like, I have it in my hand. I literally had the book in my hand. And I was getting an email from boom. Being like, that comes out this week. I'm like, how the hell do I have it in my hand? LCS owner was like, there was a whole thing between like diamond and it gets sent by Diamond. And then the actual solicitation through Penguin Random House was a different one. And they're re soliciting because some people didn't get it or something like that. I'm like, oh, okay. But I'm like, Tony's out there, like, buy my book this week. I'm like, I, I have it. How did I get it so far? Like nothing special. I went to the LCS and bought it. It was the weirdest thing. But yeah.
And then obviously Lunar distributes Image. That's been a little bit smoother going on over there. So those things have been coming out. But yeah, when this issue, this episode drops, which will be Wednesday, the second issue is coming out to hit people. And I'm So pumped for people to actually get to read more of this series because it's just so much fun. Do you. I mean, we've talked a little bit about it in different conversations. Here is. Do you approach, like, as you start, did you, like, write this all in, say, a week, but, like, in a timeframe and get it kind of, like, done? Because, like I said, you're working on two comics at the same time, or was this, like, write an issue, work on some. For this place, from here, write an issue. You know, that kind of thing. How did you fit this into your schedule?
[00:23:24] Speaker B: So initially it was a thing where I wrote the first issue. I wrote the first 10 pages as just, like, a pitch because we didn't know if anybody was going to want it. And so it was like, I had enough to be able to page around it for the pitch. And then we took that to Image and they said, yep. And so then from there, I finished writing the first issue, and I. I knew what each couple of issues was supposed to be like. I knew what the end was, and I knew where, how. Kind of how we were going to get there. But in working on the first issue, Adriana was bringing so many different things to what I had written that I didn't want to get too far out ahead because he was changing things in a good way that, like, sort of changed and informed different parts of it. So for the first three issues, I sort of would just, you know, write a script as Adriano was finishing the last. The prior issue.
And then by issue three, we had a really. We had kind of worked out our, like, okay, I understand what our back and forth is going to be. And from there, I went and sort of just wrote four or five, and I'm wrapping up the script on six right now. And that should have been done a month ago, but I was on the road for a month, and it was. I had other stuff going on, too. But the. But, yeah, so initially it was a sort of thing of like, a feeling out period of like, what's he going to respond to? What are these? And then once that relationship felt more or less sort of figured out, it was kind of like, okay, I can get out. And he sort of likes to, I think, having a lot of pages in front of him. He has a thing where he really. I've learned he really enjoys. He doesn't like starting and stopping. Like, he really likes to get into a flow state of like, okay, I'm going to do as much storytelling as I can, then we'll switch to Pencils. Then we'll switch to inks as opposed to, like, some people like to do, like, you know, okay, today I'm going to pencil, ink. I'm going to thumb pencil and ink a page today. And, like, so for him, he kind of likes to, you know, do each part of the process as a step, which is, you know, it's good because I feel like you get to see, you know, in that version, you get to see a lot of the book in totality before you really are. I think you're like, okay, we got to switch these things and do this.
[00:25:30] Speaker A: That's really cool. And it's cool to hear the different. Different side of how it's created. Obviously, like I said, I had to harp on it, but you're an illustrator, too, so seeing how someone el. Works differently than you on a project that you're working on is pretty cool in that sense.
[00:25:40] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:25:40] Speaker A: As well. But, like, so. So far, this place up here, Matthew had alluded to the idea that it is coming to an end some point sometime in the future.
[00:25:48] Speaker B: Yeah, we got. We're on issue. I'm finishing up drawing issue 22, and then we're going to either 30 or 31. And the point is that is when we write 30, it's going to be oversized, and it's going to be like one of those things where it's like, all right, we're at page 60. Can we split here? Or, like, do we need to just sort 30 or 31 is just based on, like, is there a natural sort of ending here to then, like, make this make sense as a. You know, because it's. It's. It's also one of those things where it's like, man, are we gonna really do the last issue perfect bound? Like, we need to maybe break it up. But yeah, so it'll. It's coming around there. But it's good because it's. You know, it's. When we started the book, we thought, you know, maybe we get one volume. So we had a version of it that was. That. And then we had the version that was the full thing. And we're like, that's three trades. And then in working on it, we were like, oh, it's six. And so it's this funny thing where it's like, you know, we got to the end of what is volume three? And we're kind of like, is volume four gonna be the last one? We're like, oh, we haven't earned the end yet. Like, we need to go out and earn that and so we. That, like, informed.
I don't know. That one's been a really interesting thing because, like, four kids when we did that, it was really, like, tight. Like we were doing a heist. And so we had to have things planned and everything was seated and all these different things. And then with Furthest Place, like I said, like, we knew exactly where we're going in the things. But, like, things crop up as you're. It's the. I think It's a George R.R. martin quote where it's like you're either. Like, you're either a gardener or you're something else. And that something else is the people who plan everything out. And the gardeners are the ones who like, plant little seeds and see what comes up. And Furthest Place is very much sort of tending a garden, whereas bad things and poor kids and dead dogs are more, you know, I don't know, making a building or something.
[00:27:34] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get it. I get that. You get that. But I mean. I mean, obviously you mentioned, like, this is coming to an end. This has been a crazy long journey that started, obviously, and you've got way more out of it than you. Than you expected to get out of it.
Are you ready to draw something else now?
[00:27:50] Speaker B: Or is it like, you know, not.
[00:27:52] Speaker A: Even doing covers and things like that, too?
[00:27:54] Speaker B: But I'm just saying, like, yeah, it'll be interesting. You know, it's a funny. You go and you look at the first issue, and then if you look at the issue I'm on now, and it's like the art looks like two different artists, I feel like, to a degree. And like, that's just a natural part of being on something for so long. And also, like, I feel like that's just kind of the artist I am, where it's like, I feel like I. I don't have a crystallized vision of what it is I'm trying to do. It's sort of.
Or like, as far as, like, you know, some people lock into it, like, Chris Samney is one of the best we've ever had, but he's been Samney now for, like, Geez, what, 20? When did he start on Daredevil? That was like, 2012. So it's like he's been doing it now for. Where it's like, he's just got this thing where it's like, for me, I'm still figuring it out, but it's. Yeah, no, it's. It's good. I'm excited for the next thing. I'm doing. It's going to be. I know what it is and it's. It's going to be a lot.
It's a very. Not probably what people would expect me to do. So we'll see.
[00:28:51] Speaker A: That's awesome.
[00:28:51] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:28:52] Speaker A: It's funny how you mentioned that like, that you changed throughout.
Killing myself for not remembering who said this, but there was a person who said that when they actually released the trade, the person went back, the illustrator went back and actually re illustrated technically, kind of like the first issue, because it was so drastically different from issue one to issue five in his mind that he's like, I can't put this in a trade this way. Like, single issues is one thing, because it's like it gets a gap of time. But when someone's like busting through a trade and they're like, who was the guy who did the first issue and who was the guy that. The last issue? They look very similar, but they're not the same. And so he was like, it wasn't like, it wasn't like, maybe just re inked it. Maybe that's what it was. I forget what it was. It was like something along those lines where he like, touched up on the first issue because he's like, you'll notice it if you actually see it. I'm like, now I can't remember who it was.
[00:29:35] Speaker B: I mean, Jim Lee wanted to do it for Hush issue one. I remember he talks about. And then he didn't, but he was like, oh, I wanted to go and do it. And then there's varying, like, all comic book artists are insane. We're all crazy people.
Like the, like Chester Brown, who's more in like the darn and quarterly sort of lit side of comics. Like, he redrew the entirety of Ed the Happy Clown like three times, which is just like, it was good the first time. Chester.
[00:29:59] Speaker A: Like, well, that goes to metal. Like, I'm a. I'm a graphic designer by trade. I designed beer can labels for a brewery. And I. I find myself where I'm like, there's. Every once in a while I want to go back and touch on a previous label, like one of our, like, core brands. I'm always like, I'll be nice to refresh that or whatever. And then I'm like, no, but I want to do something different. I want to do something new. Like, my mind is like, I've done that over. I could move past that now. I don't need to touch that anymore. And then when they're like, hey, we need a New packaging. It's a. It's a taller can or a shorter can. I'm like, oh, fun. I get to just shrink down artwork that I've done before. This is amazing. And so, like, I can see, like, wanting to perfect your thing. And obviously I said that would be a little different. If it's. So if you were in your mind think it's so drastically different from issue one to issue five or six, then yeah, I can understand going back and like, I want to re ink this or recolor it or whatever it may be because you want it to look cohesive. But to me, I'm like, I want to. I just want to work on the next thing. And that's. That's. I don't know. That's just my mind works. My attention span is just like, ah, I need to do more. Something more creative. I don't know. You've now drawn illustrated, you know, you created these projects and so on and so forth. You've now worked on the comic book series without Matthew Rosenberg. Is. Are you done now? You guys quit each other? This is it?
[00:31:06] Speaker B: Yeah, we just did 31 days in the car.
[00:31:08] Speaker A: And I said, I mean, so far, if I say that. But in the same sense, you promoted these books side by side. They came out at the same time. You had the ashcans. There was a flip ashcan kind of thing that you. You did store signings together. So it's not like you are separated from each other. But it's kind of funny, you know, you obviously got from this place, from here to finish and so on. Are you looking to write again? Are you looking to draw again? Obviously you're still in the middle of this. You'll. You'll do that thing. So. But, like. And so I don't want to get too far ahead of ourselves, but, like, has this, you know, experience of doing this new book with someone else as the illustrator, pushed you one way or the other? Or are you just like, I want to make cool comics?
[00:31:41] Speaker B: Yeah. No, I mean, it's definitely. It's definitely given me the confidence, I think, to write more in a way that, like, bad things was definitely sort of like, okay, like, we're gonna try, but it is a thing where it's like, you know, maybe it doesn't comes out and people are like, you're real bad at this. Stick to. Stick to drawing. I'd be like, okay. But no, the response to it's been great. And so, like, there's other stuff that I am going to be a writer on with Other artists that I'm already actively working on. I'd love to do another book, Adriano.
But then also to, like, just being a pure cartoonist or, you know, comic book artist with. With Matt, like, me and Matter writing a book together with that Josh Hickson's going to draw. But then also a book that, you know, I'm going to draw with Matt. And there's one other writer I'm working with who I'm going to draw some stuff for, who I've worked with a little bit. It's James. James time.
It's literally worked with, like, three writers, so it's not hard to figure out.
[00:32:37] Speaker A: But it's like someone could just Google.
[00:32:39] Speaker B: That who has Tyler Worth, Matt, James and Paul. Yeah, that's it.
[00:32:44] Speaker A: But it sounds like the Bible.
[00:32:46] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:32:49] Speaker A: You're like, I cannot work with you unless you have some sort of biblical name. It's actually just. It's in my contract now. That's pretty cool. Yeah. I'm guessing it has to do with schedule nowadays, too. You hear over and over and over again illustrators who are like. Like you mentioned, it's really hard for you to work on more than one project. So you have, like, furthest place from here doing that. And then you'll do a variant cover here or there, or, like, you can illustrate a couple pages for. For. For an anthology or a book or something like that. But, like, you're not, like, sinking yourself into a whole new project. And it's probably. There's people. I mean, I. I talked to Kyle Starks at many times. Kyle's going back on again. I talked to Scotty Young, these people who were like, I would wish I could just illustrate everything I do. It's just not possible. I've got all of these stories that I would love to tell, and I just can't tell them all as the illustrator, because it's just. There's just no time. And my arms aren't strong enough. My hands not. You know, I get cramped up and stuff like that. Like, it's just one of those things. And so, like, telling these stories and getting these things out there, and if you can figure your schedule out to. It's like, okay, I'm gonna write this, I'm gonna draw this, I'm gonna do that. Then you could probably release more than. Than a single issue or a month or something like that.
[00:33:49] Speaker B: Yeah, 100%. I mean, it is. And they're very different types of labor. You know, like, obviously, writing is way. I would. I think it's way more mentally Taxing than drawing. Drawing is much more physically taxing. You know, like, you know, writing, I'll do four hours and sometimes I get nothing. Sometimes I get 10 pages and then drawing, it's sort of like, no. I kind of know like what eight hours is going to get me kind of every single time. Sometimes, you know, things are more detailed, whatever. But it is a funny thing. And so it's like there is things where it's like, okay, I can go and do an eight hour shift or ten hour shift drawing, and then two hours, you know, have dinner, whatever, then two hours at night and you're like, all right, cool. You know, I look at like sort of Lemire and Zdarsky is sort of good career models, maybe. I'm sort of looking at where it's the thing where I think they both have their projects that is them, you know, writing and illustrating themselves. And I probably won't do that next time I do that. Who knows? But the. And that sort of feels like my map book. And then, you know, they have their other sort of licensed stuff that they work on or books that they want to tell and doing that writing is.
Yeah, they kind of go off and do that. And that feels like a good. Although I learned. I don't know how true it is, but I learned what Lemire does and I'm like, that's. I can't do it like that. That scheduling doesn't make sense to me.
But yeah, I don't know. It's. It's. You know, I wrote on James's new series Exquisite Corpses with Michael Arc. And so that was a really, you know, being in the writers room with people like James and Che Grayson and Porn Sack Pigeon Choate and like learning from them how to be in the room and be like, oh, I can hang, I can do this. Like, it's sort of things where it gives you the confidence a little bit too, to like, be like, okay, like, because it's. When I put out dead dogs, I, you know, I wrote, drew, colored, lettered. I did the whole thing except for edit it and, you know, did the design even. And it was a thing where I called Matt like the night before it came out. And I was like, man, if this thing sucks, like, it's just my fault.
[00:35:51] Speaker A: Like, I can't, I can't blame anybody else.
[00:35:54] Speaker B: And I was like, why didn't you tell me? Like, the anxiety that's involved with being a writer and like doing these things where it's like, it almost feels like as an artist, like, I don't have the same level of pressure about it and with bad things. Like, there was maybe still some of that anxiety, but. But it was helped by the fact that I had a partner in Adriano and Hassan and, you know, the backing of Tiny Onion's editorial team of Eric Harburn and Steve Fox.
[00:36:17] Speaker A: So it's a. It's. Now you have someone to blame. So that.
[00:36:21] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. I got a bunch of people to be like, look at this horrible thing we all made together.
[00:36:24] Speaker A: It's amazing. And everybody else would be like, well, Tyler, you don't write that often, so it's probably your fault. The other guys are pretty good, so I don't know what you're doing. It's a. Yeah, it's. It's a. It's crazy. And I love the. That, that, that collaboration. And there's not this hostility either. You mentioned being in the room with Tiny and those people, like, you know, that. That you could see in a world people on the fringe of comics could see, like when a person who's dedicated to illustrating, doing a bunch of variant covers, you know, I've been illustrating books for a while. Slides into the writing seat that they could have like a, like an animosity towards them because, like, hey, you're infringing on my side of things in this industry. And it's not like that. It's a lot of that crossover is really good. You don't see the opposite happen that often because it's usually the people who go. The number of times. I've been told on the podcast I started writing comic books because I tried to draw and I suck. And there's that. There's more of that than there is the opposite side of this, I think. Yeah, you see that. And it's like, it's cool little, you know, world collaboration world that we live in in comics and seeing these things and seeing your ability to do it and you did it well. And, you know, not that you need my approval on that, but I do.
[00:37:30] Speaker B: I need everybody's approval.
[00:37:32] Speaker A: You'll Do Bad Things is excellent. And I think it's going to continue on to be a great comic. And I'm pretty excited for people. People to read it who haven't. If you haven't read it, you need to go get it. It's. It's actually phenomenal. It's also a slightly smaller title than Matthew Rosenberg's book, so it's.
[00:37:45] Speaker B: Mine are always a couple words shorter.
[00:37:47] Speaker A: You gotta do that. You gotta. You gotta tell it a little bit off. Matthew's like, that's not. That's too long.
[00:37:52] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:37:53] Speaker A: Or the Steve Fox came to you and said, yeah, you gotta edit that down.
[00:37:55] Speaker B: You gotta edit that.
[00:37:58] Speaker A: But yeah, it's a. Cool. And I got. I got issue one right here, actually. It's right here. You'll do bad things. It's a.
[00:38:04] Speaker B: It's a.
[00:38:04] Speaker A: It's a. It's an awesome comic book. It's a. It's a comic that works well too with what people like right now, with true crime and those kind of things as well too. I think that's a thing to get out there and explain to people. I'll kind of explain it at the top of the episode when I do my intro of what it is. But like, people wonder, like, it's like a. If you're not into comics, you might be into this too because of the fact that it's kind of a true crime esque side of things as well. So that's pretty cool. And then I also got this book here too. I don't know what this one is.
[00:38:29] Speaker B: That's. We're taking everyone to the.
[00:38:33] Speaker A: There you go.
[00:38:33] Speaker B: Oh, Nick's response. Got the hashtag.
[00:38:37] Speaker A: And then I found this at the.
[00:38:38] Speaker B: I feel like it's the furthest place behind you too.
[00:38:40] Speaker A: Oh, that's the furthest place here. Yeah, yeah, that's issue two back there.
[00:38:43] Speaker B: Yeah. Awesome.
[00:38:43] Speaker A: I kind of slid it over there because it's actually over here is issue three. I don't know if you can see it.
[00:38:47] Speaker B: Oh yeah, I can see it right there.
[00:38:49] Speaker A: I found this in that dollar bin at the other day.
[00:38:52] Speaker B: Nice.
[00:38:52] Speaker A: I just got it because I'm like.
[00:38:53] Speaker B: Who even published it?
[00:38:56] Speaker A: I don't even know. Idw. Oh, idw. Like a weird IDW logo. Like a. Like a. I don't know. I guess there's a double edition where it had McCain as the back. Like a flip over. It was McCain. I was like, I don't know. I just wanted it.
[00:39:08] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure.
[00:39:10] Speaker A: But yeah, so it's. It's. I can't. I can't wait for people to read it. I. I can't. I don't know how to say anything else about it. That's amazing. I. I'm super excited that you're into writing comics more now. And I'm looking forward to the next thing. I'm looking forward to the ending of what's the first place I'm here not because I want it to end, but I'm also like. It's just one of those things where I'm like, we're living in such a world of miniseries and maxi series that like 30 issues is a lot to be like, oh, yeah, I can commit to that. And every week you're like, I can't. I will say the best part about it is the fact that they've been like big issues over pretty much every issue, and they're only 399. So you guys are losing money on it. But.
[00:39:45] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, we're not good business people.
[00:39:49] Speaker A: I mean, Todd McFarlane came out recently and just raised the price of spawn from 299 to 399 now. So, I mean, you know, I bet I'm not going to say this because you probably are going to charge more for it, but your final issue is probably 399.
[00:40:02] Speaker B: It'll be the same price. Yeah, it'll be.
[00:40:04] Speaker A: I think we're going to do this for 299.
Go down on it. No, that's pretty awesome. I'm super excited. I'm super pumped for you and everything that you're doing.
And again, you know, what's. The first place I'm here is still going. So check those out. The trades are. What trade are you on again?
[00:40:22] Speaker B: 3. Volume 4 just came out in February. And then. Yeah, we're halfway through drawing and making volume five. So volume five will be 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25.
[00:40:34] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:40:34] Speaker B: Yeah. So we're on 22 going to 25. That's volume five. And then that's the penultimate one before we get to the big show.
[00:40:42] Speaker A: Yeah, that's pretty cool. That's so awesome. And then there'll be six issues of. You'll do Bad Things with issue two hitting right now. But hopefully it's not there because hopefully people bought it. But if not, ask your LCs. Like, hey, is there a copy I can get? I don't know if Lunar has distribution level of it still, but I'm not.
[00:40:59] Speaker B: I don't know. Yeah, I don't know if I don't have access to distributor yet, but the. There is a second print of issue 1 out also on that day. So we have that in that. Okay, there you go. So they should. They should be out, hopefully.
[00:41:11] Speaker A: Yes, they should be. They're not going to second printing. I don't know what the world we live in today with the whole, like, you know, we are sold out, we have limited copies. All this thing. I'm like, I don't know how that works, man. Yeah, I forget, like, it was a berserker There was like, second printing was like, way more valuable than first one because they only printed like 50 copies of the second one, thinking that they didn't need that many. And then they ended up needing like 7 prints of it or something like that. It was a weird thing.
[00:41:36] Speaker B: It was a weird thing from that era too, of like, Pandemic Fire, where, like, so many of those people treated second prints and third prints or whatever as almost like first print but different variant covers where it was a thing where I was like, oh, this is a whole world I need. No, I'm at.
[00:41:51] Speaker A: Well, that was the argument we always have at the LCS about like, oh, second printing of the first appearance of Miles Mirrors. I'm like, that's not though. That's not even close, because the first printing is it. And then it goes on. The key comic collector has like a second cameo or something like that. I'm like, that doesn't make any sense.
[00:42:07] Speaker B: That's not.
[00:42:08] Speaker A: Whatever.
[00:42:09] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:42:09] Speaker A: I mean, it's a cameo of.
[00:42:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I really liked. And this is. This is not an element as a shot. It truly. But Rob Liefeld celebrating 33 years of Youngblood, where I'm like, I didn't know. 33. Like, I love that. He's just like, yeah, it. 33 years. Yeah, three and three. That's cool, I guess, man.
[00:42:29] Speaker A: My thought that is like, I don't know, maybe he wanted to do 35. He's like, I don't know. Will I be around, like, to in comics anymore in 35? So let's just do 33 years. Let's do this.
[00:42:37] Speaker B: I love it.
[00:42:38] Speaker A: I'm in the news a lot right now. Like, a lot of people are talking about me. So this is probably the time to capitalize on me doing this right now. But no, it's great. It's. I saw that on the shelf the other day. I was like, I can't believe it's been that long too. It's crazy. 33 years ago. It's been a long time. And it's pretty crazy how long it's been. I mean, my 39th birthday is coming up right here, and I just feel like it's. It's. Time's flying. You mentioned the pandemic, and I felt like it was yesterday and it's really been five years. It's insane.
[00:43:00] Speaker B: I know. Yeah. Time has been both elongated and shortened in a way that no longer makes sense.
[00:43:07] Speaker A: But, yeah, you'll do bad things. Second printing. First. First issue one, you mentioned out and then as well, the same day Issue two should grab both those issues and then keep. Tell your local comic book shop you want three, four, five, six and so on. And then. Yeah, jump on. What's the furthest place from here? Most comic shops should have volume one. I know what. My comic book shop keeps it in stock because it's. What's one of their top selling books right there next to Something's Killing the Children and. And stuff like that. So that's the one they keep in stock for sure. Yeah, it's pretty great. He hates when he puts it on the. The poll list every week though, because of how long the title. So just say that much. Yeah, I mean, obviously, you know, it's how long it is because you keep on just calling. We go off for this place. But you also do a bad things. You cut. You cut the first two weeks words off of you'll do bad things.
[00:43:52] Speaker B: I try to shorten everything. Even. Even dead dogs bite. I just call dead dogs. It's the thing where every. Everything I try to get to two. The fucking. The one we're doing. Sorry for swearing. My bad. The. The one we, me and Matt are doing with Josh Vixen. Matt tried to put a comma in it and I was like, no, dude, we can't. Like, you can't.
[00:44:08] Speaker A: No, you can't do it. First I just had this discussion with. I forget. I was at a low Comic Con a couple weeks ago and I was having this discussion because Alex Cormack and Anthony Cleveland just came out with their book at Mad Cave that was buried along comma long ago and it screws up with like SEO algorithms on the Internet too. I'm like, not only is it probably too long to have a comma in there, Matt, but it's like with you put a comma in there, it becomes two keywords instead of one keyword. Like, you'll do bad things is one thing. If you did, you'll do that things comma, something else. It'll be two different things. And I'm like, you can't stop doing the comma thing. But knowing Matt, it's probably just a really long sentence that he needs a really long.
[00:44:44] Speaker B: Just a run on sentence grammar.
[00:44:46] Speaker A: Read.
Yeah, but I'm so glad. Like I said, Tyler, I'm glad you were able to come on and chat comics and you'll do bad things and so much more. We look forward to everything that's coming out in the future. But people, for now, grab what Matt has or I'm sorry, Matt Tyler has on the shelf right now. And Matt technically with Grab Matt stuff too.
[00:45:02] Speaker B: I'm on most of them.
[00:45:04] Speaker A: Exactly. You might as well at this point. But yeah, I really appreciate you taking the time out and doing this and good luck with the rest of the stuff and good luck with more issue releases of this and finishing up. What's the furthest place from here? I know you've got a lot of work ahead of you.
[00:45:17] Speaker B: Yeah, thanks so much, sir. There's.
